I received a PCN on 1st April. I called TFL and requested to post its recorded contravention DVD. They given a ref# and put my ticket on hold for 14 days.

I never received anything, I was away on Easter holidays, forgot this completely. Last weekend I was clearing my draw and found the PCN. I called them straightaway,
they checked their system, 'they posted the cctv dvd but... they apologised and resending another DVD, the ticket is on hold again for 14 days, he said, and given another ref#.


Please correct me here, should the amount not stay same £65 ?
I just checked it online on their website - showing £195

The ticket status history
03 June 2019 On Hold
The PCN has been placed on hold. While it's on hold it will not progress.

03 June 2019 Charge Certificate Batched
N/A

13 April 2019 On Hold
The PCN has been placed on hold. While it's on hold it will not progress.

01 April 2019 On Hold
The PCN has been placed on hold. While it's on hold it will not progress.

28 March 2019 PCN Batched
N/A

You just want the audio recording.

I'm minded to say that you should write back to TFL and explain that you spoke to Mr.XXXXX, their service agent on 3rd June ref:XXXX, and the representation has been made within the extended deadline confirmed by Mr XXXXX.

Please suggest on this?

Regarding SAR; I believe their address is 'Red routes PO Box 335 Darlington DL1 9PU', I think recorded post doesn't like PO box therefore standard post should be fine - correct


Also, on their website the PCN current status is 'Representation submitted Under review' - does it mean I am expecting their reply on this



This post has been edited by helping_hand: Sun, 30 Jun 2019 - 16:07

Normal post is fine but get a certificate of posting. This means you need to send it via a post office.

If you go to https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/privacy-and-co...#on-this-page-5 there's a form you can download for "TfL's Customer Contact Centre", it also gives the address where you must send it - which is not the address you've identified above.


Maybe? You could phone and ask.

Today they have received my letter, I confirmed the content as well

So what I should do as my next step?




just for info,
yesterday's agent was defending the CC - that it was issued in the morning and I called in the afternoon on 3/6
very politely I avoided any words to speak out other than to confirm if the letter showing in their system, but wasn't.

What letter? How did you confirm the content?


Which letter? And where did you send it?

Procedurally the next stage is that they would issue an Order for Recovery, a SAR is extra-procedural and IMO does not address the issue i.e. what options would be available to you upon receipt of an OfR?

The answer is fairly obvious, you could either submit a witness statement(WS) or not. If you did not, then you would be left with arguing the toss with the council, but not within procedure.

IMO, you would be justified in submitting a WS under the grounds that you submitted reps but did not receive a response as prescribed.

The issue for you is that you must sign a statement of truth in support of your submission and this should not be taken lightly.

IMO, at the heart of this is their undertaking on receipt of your request for a DVD. On the basis of what you've posted, this is that they undertook to stop progression of the PCN until you received the DVD.

But they did progress it on the basis that they thought they had sent and you had received the DVD. They were wrong on the second count and possibly the first. Therefore, as you made reps absent the DVD, at what stage in the proceedings from your perspective and their undertakings did this occur? IMO, before the end of the period during which they had obligated themselves to consider reps.

Taken in the round, I think you would be justified in submitting a WS as above. At best your SAR would confirm what you say transpired, but this would not affect how your current situation would be considered in the context of the General and Appeals Regs.

Others will have views.

I thought I should write to tfl instead using SAR form. in order to provide my phone recording with the agent.
I wrote to them and have a posting certificate.


I still phoned and made sure it was a correct address (from their Later Reps Notice). They confirmed they have received it.


Am I done something incorrect here?

Thank you for explaining this..




Please explain this; ,at what stage in the....?


Also, what is their procedure on holding timeframe?

You can answer your question better than me.

What did you understand your initial conversation with them to mean?

1. We will not progress enforcement until you have received the DVD which you've requested, or
2. We will send you a DVD but irrespective of whether you receive this or not we will press ahead with enforcement regardless?

Surely it was point#1
I assume they will send my phone conversation recording in a CD/DVD disk. Once I have it, this is my WS and from this point I should take my next step.

Although on their website the ticket is on-hold, but do I need to find out if its still progressing?

Of course it was point #1 which, IMO, entitles you to submit a witness statement under the grounds I've suggested. This is the only point of law which is at issue, all the other facts as regards procedure are already in play:

You were issued with a PCN;
You requested the DVD as is your right;
They agreed to send and undertook/obligated themselves to hold enforcement until they had received your response;
In the absence of any response from you within a reasonable period and believing that the DVD had been issued and received by you they progressed enforcement;
As soon as you were alerted to this (i.e you received a CC) you contacted them to advise them of their mistake i.e. that you had not received the DVD - your account is unclear, and maybe they are unclear, as to whether they had actually sent the DVD;
Despite their assurance that the matter was still on hold you submitted representations to which you believe they were obligated to respond;
They disregarded these reps for being submitted too late and they did not exercise their discretion to consider(which IMO
they were obligated to do)


You now await the OfR.

Much appreciated the steps you explained in detail


This means Statutory Declaration time has been passed. So in your experience; do they exercise OfR only or do they response to my SAR and/or both at same time.

Also, do the amount increase again from £195

The OfR will increase the penalty by £8, but the statutory declaration resets it to £130.

The OfR and the SAR are unrelated, they're done by different teams under different legislation, one does not affect the other.

How should I inform the concerning bodies that I will be on holidays from 7/8 for 3 weeks. I received another dvd (3rd recorded delivery) since but no OfR

Is there anyone who can open your post for you while you're away?

You don't need to have the OfR in your hands in order to complete the witness statement, this can be downloaded from the HMCTS website. All you need to know is that the OfR has been served (which you would get by phoning the authority every 2 or 3 days) and to have the details for the top-right box to hand.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/go...336/te9-eng.pdf

You will see that it's not the most complex document and you can print off a copy before you go(make it 2 or 3 for safety's sake!)

Are you going abroad? If so, you would probably need to submit electronically, TEC can help.

No SAR received, should I chase them?

Yes going abroad, can request my friend to visit my house check/open post. Or I actually like the option to call them and obtain OfR#
assuming same TfL team phone number in the PCN?


Please confirm the TE9;

1. Top right box, 3rd line 'Applicant' is it my name to add?
2. Which option, I was thinking both (*);

*I appealed against the local authority’s decision to reject my representation, within 28 days of service of the rejection notice, but have had no response to my appeal.
*I made representations about the penalty charge to the enforcing authority concerned within 28 days of the service of the Notice to Owner, but did not receive a rejection notice.

3. Do I also need the recording conversation between myself and the agent?

Thank you

It might be easier to just call TfL and get the case number, I don't think it matters much as long as you find out when the OfR is served. The applicant is the council, you're the respondent. The relevant ground is that you made a representation but did not receive a Notice of Rejection.

Given their track record to date, I would record any telephone calls you make.

I have now received the OfR. Filing a witness statement TE9 form and emailing them. I think I need to tick the two below options:

1: I did not receive the Notice to Owner
2: I made reprs on Notice to Owner but didn't receive NoR
--- And not----
3: I appealed London Tribunal...
4: The PCN has been paid in full



Please confirm
1) TE9 form name: I should put Respondent (not my actual name) but my address - correct?
2) Do I need to write all the details at this stage regarding this case from scratch?
3) Regarding ph conversation recording with the agent, I only have time stamps. I can chase the council again to provide the recording?