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Possible Speeding Ticket - Queensbridge Rd, Hackney
John121
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:20
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Hey guys,
I was driving my dads vehicle on Queensbridge Road, and speed limit was 20mph.

Speed camera was next to traffic lights, I do remember slightly accelerating to pass the traffic light as it was about to turn red, however I'm sure I didn't go over 20mph.

However the camera did flash, after having observed the camera it seems as though its for 2 lanes so I can't remember if there was anyone on the other lane which it may have flashed for. But I do remember the traffic lights just about turning red when I went past them, so not sure if these cameras are designed to flash if you go through red light.

Below is the location of the camera: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.5353415,-...3312!8i6656

Please let me know your thoughts? Also if It does turn out to be a speeding ticket or going through red light, whats the possible fines or points I am likely to receive?

Ive never had any points in my life nor have I received any speeding fines before.

Any help will be much appreciated.

Thanks
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post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:20
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BaggieBoy
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:32
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It's certainly monitoring the red light, it might also be a speed camera. However if you saw the light red as you passed it, it's highly likely you have been detected for the red light offence. It would be 3 points and £100 fixed penalty.
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Logician
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:44
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Or a course for either offence, provided you have not done for a similar offence within the last three years


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John121
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 06:46
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Wow. I'm definitely screwed then. Yes I've never done a course. Do there allow you do a course if you go through red light? I thought course was more for speeding.

Also will there be a fine associated with this?

Any way whatsoever this can be overturned?
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BaggieBoy
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 07:12
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QUOTE (John121 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 06:46) *
Wow. I'm definitely screwed then. Yes I've never done a course. Do there allow you do a course if you go through red light? I thought course was more for speeding.

There are courses for offences other than speeding, red light offences is one.

QUOTE (John121 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 06:46) *
Also will there be a fine associated with this?

There is a course fee, probably around the same cost as the fixed penalty fine, i.e. £100.

QUOTE (John121 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 06:46) *
Any way whatsoever this can be overturned?

If you actually passed the stop line when the light is red, probably no. Red light camera are notorious for being accurate.
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Jlc
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 08:33
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QUOTE (John121 @ Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:20) *
Speed camera was next to traffic lights, I do remember slightly accelerating to pass the traffic light as it was about to turn red, however I'm sure I didn't go over 20mph.

An amber light means stop - it is illuminated for around 3 seconds. You can only pass during the amber phase if you a so close to the stop line you cannot stop before red is illuminated. Accelerating is generally an indication you should have stopped.

If you have been caught then you would have passed at red. The camera doesn't arm until a short time after red is illuminated. Like many posters that insist they passed at amber often find the pictures show a clear red.

But for now you have to wait and see if your Dad receives a NIP (within 14 days if he is the registered keeper). They may supply a photo if asked.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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John121
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 08:42
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OMG - my dads going to kill me. If nothing is received within 14 days does that mean its safe to presume I wont get anything?

Also, I was the driver so is it right in thinking that my dad wont be affected as I will have to give my details and possibly do the course?
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666
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 09:12
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 08:33) *
QUOTE (John121 @ Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 23:20) *
Speed camera was next to traffic lights, I do remember slightly accelerating to pass the traffic light as it was about to turn red, however I'm sure I didn't go over 20mph.

An amber light means stop - it is illuminated for around 3 seconds. You can only pass during the amber phase if you a so close to the stop line you cannot stop before red is illuminated. Accelerating is generally an indication you should have stopped.

If you have been caught then you would have passed at red. The camera doesn't arm until a short time after red is illuminated. Like many posters that insist they passed at amber often find the pictures show a clear red.


Don't forget also that the offence is committed when any part of the vehicle crosses the line. You may well see amber from the driver's seat, but there are several feet of car behind you still to cross the line.
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Slapdash
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 09:34
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QUOTE (John121 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 08:42) *
OMG - my dads going to kill me. If nothing is received within 14 days does that mean its safe to presume I wont get anything?

Also, I was the driver so is it right in thinking that my dad wont be affected as I will have to give my details and possibly do the course?


Your dad is affected - in a minor way.

The first NIP will be sent to the registered keeper of the car. That may not be dad. If the car is on finance it is most likely the finance company. Or it could be his company if a company car or a leasing company.

The finance company will nominate your dad as he is the keeper on a daily basis. It is only this nip which is affected by the 14 day rule.

When your dad gets a NIP in his name he needs to respond saying "junior was driving". Hence he is affected in that he must do something. It also means he is aware of the incident.

If he doesnt respind within the correct timeframe then he commits an offence (a more serious one than the underlying offence).




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Jlc
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 09:49
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QUOTE (666 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 09:12) *
Don't forget also that the offence is committed when any part of the vehicle crosses the line. You may well see amber from the driver's seat, but there are several feet of car behind you still to cross the line.

That's true but the small delay in the camera arming would usually cover this from an ACD point of view (even if the offence was strictly committed).

QUOTE (John121 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 08:42) *
OMG - my dads going to kill me. If nothing is received within 14 days does that mean its safe to presume I wont get anything?

Also, I was the driver so is it right in thinking that my dad wont be affected as I will have to give my details and possibly do the course?

If caught it's a relatively minor offence. If he is the registered keeper then notification needs to be sent to him within 14 days. He simply names you and you receive your own nomination form to complete before offers are made (course/fixed penalty etc.)

But this is all supposition at the moment...


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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John121
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 11:27
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Why is it supposition? You reckon it might not come through.

I can confirm car is NOT on lease or financial agreement and its my dads privately owned car and he is the registered owner and keeper of the car.

If notification is not received within 14 days is this a valid ground to challenge?

This post has been edited by John121: Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 11:28
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The Rookie
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 11:43
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He may be the registered keeper, he can’t be the registered owner as that concept doesn’t exist.


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DancingDad
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 12:34
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Tell dad now.
Yes he may shout and bawl but at least he knows something may drop through the post.
If it does, he must respond. Naming you and providing your details.
You will then get your own letter that you must respond to.
No point worrying on it, it either will happen or it won't.
Nowt you can do will alter that and worrying serves no purpose.
If something does come though, dad then you must deal with it.
Which may mean a course or points and a fine but either way, it is that or accept that it could go to court and the likely ramifications of that.

What neither you or your dad must do is ignore any notice that comes through.
Or be tempted to lie.
Either choice will lead to far worse results then you face at the moment.
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John121
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 12:43
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Very helpful. Thats fine.

I'll let him know and defo respond.

Thanks a million.
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DancingDad
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 13:16
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IF something does come through, post it up in the speeding/criminal forum and let the experts on there comment.
Something may be possible, may not but at least you will know.
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southpaw82
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 13:17
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Your dad may be affected if it increases his insurance premium.


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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DancingDad
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 14:15
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 13:17) *
Your dad may be affected if it increases his insurance premium.


Something Dad can rectify by removing you from named driver list if you do end up with points and insurance need notifying (or asks at renewal)
Or charge you the extra biggrin.gif

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John121
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 14:26
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I'm not even on his insurance policy.
I have my own insurance policy which also covers me as any driver on another vehicle.
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stamfordman
post Thu, 14 Mar 2019 - 09:14
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I drive through that junction often twice a day sometimes n/s sometimes e/w - on n/s I've never seen anyone set off that camera.
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John121
post Thu, 14 Mar 2019 - 11:47
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Not sure about near side but the left side (driver side) it defo does flash.
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